Byod

**Brian** · 08-10-2008 06:10 AM

Wow, thanks for the response Tim. I don't think anyone really expects anything different, or is even unhappy with what you just said. Just like with Express, although the decisions may not be popular, you're trying to build a sustainable company, and you have to do what you have to do in order to achieve those goals. I think everything you said is reasonable, although I still do you think you'll alienate a (fairly small) portion of your potential customer base. Of course, most of your legit big BYOD folks are already on the BETA

I guess I just want to make sure we're all clear, before we go "live". Those of us using non-Grandstream devices today - should our current devices die, or for whatever reason we decide we need to switch to a VOIPo device, what would be the procedure and/or cost to do so? (I certainly don't today, but just want the cards on the table up front

)

**burris** · 08-10-2008 06:49 AM

Originally Posted by Brian

Wow, thanks for the response Tim. I don't think anyone really expects anything different, or is even unhappy with what you just said. Just like with Express, although the decisions may not be popular, you're trying to build a sustainable company, and you have to do what you have to do in order to achieve those goals. I think everything you said is reasonable, although I still do you think you'll alienate a (fairly small) portion of your potential customer base. Of course, most of your legit big BYOD folks are already on the BETA

I guess I just want to make sure we're all clear, before we go "live". Those of us using non-Grandstream devices today - should our current devices die, or for whatever reason we decide we need to switch to a VOIPo device, what would be the procedure and/or cost to do so? (I certainly don't today, but just want the cards on the table up front

)

You posed a question that has been asked a few times.

I totally agree that the goal should be to have a solid, reliable service that is controlled by the provider. Otherwise you will run into the VT syndrome. Of course, in their case, there seems to be no resolution no matter who is in control....and by the results of the posts in their forum, getting worse by the day..

My request would be the same as yours, and it has already served me well when my GS stopped working for me. I simply plugged in my SPA2102 and since it was pre- programmed from the very beginning before I got my GS, it saved me from a divorce.

That's the only thing I would request...that is to be able to use it for a backup.

**gbh2o** · 08-10-2008 01:04 PM

Originally Posted by VOIPoTim

First just so we're clear, we're not going to force any existing BETA users to stop using BYOD. You'll still be able to continue as a BYOD user, but it'll be 100% unsupported and we can't gurantee things will always work for you.

...deleted...

Again, I know BYOD is important for some users and can appreciate that. For our business model and mass market target though, it just doesn't work well.

This is probably not what anyone wants to hear and it's certainly not what a lot of companies will admit, but it's just reality....

...deleted...

I'm glad I don't have to give up my BYOD devices, since you hooked me with your _service_ :-) But honestly, as a beta tester, I would have gone away happily to help ensure your business model is successful if you had banished us. No problem... that's what happens to beta testers; I don't believe we should expect any special privileges, just because we had some free time on our hands and could volunteer. :-) Our reward is just seeing something we contributed to become successful.

At the same time, I don't believe any rational company should support BYOD on anything other than a PAYG/on-demand plan which helps protect both ends with it's inherently limited balances. I think the hobby asterisk users of us, as well as the SOHO and commercial users, recognize that PAYG/on-demand service is really the most economical path for us. We can understand and appreciate the usefulness of the Express plan while we pine away waiting for the Carrier system to rise from the ashes, 'one-of-these-days-real-soon-now'! ;-) Hopefully the beta testers you have grand-fathered will not abuse your 'founders' plan too badly. Of course, without the ability to set the outbound CID, it is restricted pretty much to properly servicing a single outbound location anyway.

The true home/residential user has no idea how many minutes a month they need or want, so they willingly join the 'unlimited' herd. And, for most of them, really will 'overpay' to make sure they always have enough under unusual conditions. They just want it to work when they pick up a handset and don't like surprise changes in their monthly budget. You should do whatever necessary to ensure that is what they receive since they will be the great majority of your clients (for now).

**christcorp** · 08-10-2008 02:26 PM

Personally, the only advantages I've ever seen with BYOD are 1)Convenience of immediate service and 2)Dial plan / feature codes that a provider might not provide. Don't get me wrong. Those who know me, know that I have about a dozen pap2, rt31p2, zoom, and dlinks floating around. All unlocked BYOD. That's not counting the locked vonage/packet8/etc... devices I have.

Yes, it's fun to play with them. And using fxo/fxs cards, I could go the cheap experimenting by taking my voip adapters and connecting them to a trixbox and such to play. But all in all, except for the hobbiest, there aren't really any need for a byod service.

If the provider's features and codes are all done at the SIP server level, and they have all the dialplan and codes available; and/or allow you to make unique codes in your online account; e.g. call routing 511/411 etc... Then what is the advantage of a BYOD? There really isn't one. The only real advantage is calling up a provider and being connected 5 minutes later.

Vonage and Packet8; the largest 2 3rd party providers, don't do BYOD and they have the largest customer base. They also have probably some of the best uptime rates and lowest customer equipment issues of all the providers. Almost every provider offers the adapter for free, along with other perks, so price definitely isn't an issue either.

I'm not bringing this up for arguments and debating purposes. I only bring it up to try and understand the "Why" factor. Other than the "It's mine and I want to use MINE" argument. As well as the IMMEDIATE service capability; maybe someone can share what advantage to a normal telephone user, having BYOD offers? Even those who are serious about trix/asterisk use direct IP connection. Just curious about what an unlocked PAP2 offers the customer that the grandstream 286 and vpanel access that voipo offers doesn't. Again, not trying to start a debate or argument. Just trying to figure out if there's some feature or capability that the BYOD device offers that maybe VoipO could accomodate from a different perspective. And the MAJOR REASON I bring this up, is because of comments I read in the BBR/DSlReports posts where some people said if they cant do BYOD with VoipO, then it was an immediate DEAL BREAKER!!!! WHY? I just don't get it!!! Later... Mike....

**fisamo** · 08-10-2008 03:14 PM

I think the people who state that lack of BYOD is a deal-breaker are those that Tim isn't targeting with this service offering. I'd expect Tim to get some of these people to sign up for the Carrier plan when (notice I didn't say if

) it's offered, especially when (again, not if) the Residential service proves itself in terms of reliability, quality, etc.

As one of the Asterisk/Trix/PIAF hobbyists, I normally wouldn't sign up for an unlimited plan to meet my hobby needs, but I did take Tim up on his generous offer for the $99/yr Founder's club plan as a 2nd line. Given the extent of my use (at least for the next few years), Tim will still be making money off my line.

Those tables will turn, though, when my girls reach the teenage years...