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VOIPoTim
03-05-2009, 04:54 AM
We are still seeing about 10% of the Grandstream HT502 adapters that are in use by our customers not properly maintaining their connection to our network and not reconnecting to our network when there is any kind of a short network interruption.

With the adapters in question, you've likely had to reboot them when they've lost their connection in order to get them to reconnect to our network so they can receive incoming calls. This is not the way they are supposed to function and they should not need regular reboots. Even when there is a service outage, they should automatically recover from that on their own without you needing to do anything.

We've been working with Grandstream to isolate the issue and identify the commonalities in the devices experiencing issues in order to find a fix. So far, this has been unsuccessful.

While the majority of them are maintaining their connection properly, the 10% that are not have created a great deal of problems and made our service seem very unrelaible for many of you.

Once this issue surfaced, we halted shipments of them and began shipping Linksys PAP2 adapters for new orders. The Linksys devices have been problem-free, stayed connected, and reconnected nearly instantly on their own after outages. In a nutshell, they performed as expected and have allowed us to deliver a reliable service that better resembles the stable service we've delivered over the past two years.

At this point, we are preparing for a potential large-scale recall of the Grandstream HT502 devices exhibiting this behavior.

On Thursday, we're going to work with suppliers to determine how quickly we can secure the necessary additional Linksys PAP2 inventory for the replacements and plan out the logistics involved.

Our developers will also be working with Grandstream on Thursday to explain that we're about to issue a "recall" to pull their devices from our network as a last resort to make sure there is nothing else that can be done. If there's not a final "fix" from Grandstream that we feel comfortable with in place by the end of this week, we'll begin the replacements next week.

While this is a very expensive proposition, I feel it's necessary to restore stability for the customers with the devices in question so they can truly experience VOIPo service. In addition, nearly all our support load is related to this issue so we want to move on and start focusing again on enhancing service for all customers. Overall, it's just the right thing to do unless by some miracle Grandstream provides us with a fix on Thursday.

We want to thank all of you for your patience as we've worked through this and sincerely apologize for any inconvenience it's caused you if you have one of the devices in question.

We appreciate your business and continued confident in VOIPo. Expect an update on Friday.

GPM
03-05-2009, 08:48 AM
I appear to be one of 10%. My 502 sits between my Qwest DSL modem and Netgear router. I've had to manually reboot after both of the recent major hits and occasionally before that.

I've gotten to where I check my registration first thing every morning and periodically throughout the day, time permitting. A permanent solution would be appreciated.

rpvitale
03-05-2009, 09:12 AM
Me too. I wish there was a way that you system could email or text me when it looses connectivity to the ata. I always seem to find out it needs a reboot when someone calls my cell telling me the home phone doesn't work.

jt7891
03-05-2009, 09:26 AM
I have a PAP2T adapter and like it a lot. It's been ultra stable and I'm partial to the Cisco/Linksys quality and reliability, so I have no problem with Voipo's decision to head in that direction. But the PAP2T I recently purchased has only one network port, whereas the Grandstream has two (one LAN, one WAN). By virtue of only having one network port on the PAP2T, most of your clients like me will simply plug it in behind the router, but yet Voipo wants the adapter in front of the router so Voipo tech's can "see" it in the event remote diagnostics are required. Is there a two port version of the PAP2T that Voipo is shipping out? Or is Voipo abandoning the requirement to keep the adapter in front of the router?

Thank you

myvoip07
03-05-2009, 11:17 AM
Tim, thanks for the update. Hoping GS comes with a permanent fix.

I appear to be one of the 10%. Seems like my HT502 also lost registration sometime early this morning and will be like that till i go home and reboot it. If required i can look into my syslog server and find out what time exactly i lost registration.

Just logged in to Vpanel and no device is registered. Outgoing is working fine. Incoming goes to VM.

dahotvet
03-05-2009, 11:38 AM
I am also one of the 10%.
My GS is behind a Linksys router and cable modem and has become unregistered with each of these network glitches as well as several other times. My concern in having it in front of the router was based on my CIO experience- test any new piece of gear carefully. If you have an alternative, don't put it in a critical spot. I understood the potential for manual interaction when placed behind a NAT and was comfortable with it. Without knowing the intimate details of the ATA configuration, there should be several reliable methods to "call home" without too much overhead required by the servers or the ATA.

That being said, I am out of state much of the time and my dear technophobic wife has been saddled with the responsibility of manually resetting the ATA when it becomes disabled. Even though I was able to tell her about the ***999 phone based reset, the reliability concerns are rapidly degrading the WAF (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woman_acceptance_factor) of our internet phone initiative.

The PAP2T looks good since it has a proven "call home" feature- especially tested recently. If it does, the WAF will steadily rise.

Thanks for staying on top of this.

VOIPoTim
03-05-2009, 11:41 AM
The PAP2T looks good since it has a proven "call home" feature- especially tested recently. If it does, the WAF will steadily rise.

Thanks for staying on top of this.

The PAP2s give us more options as well. For example, we can send a reboot request or cause provisioning to resync without a reboot right in the SIP headers so it doesn't matter if it's behind the router or not.

So as an example, we can add a "reboot" option in vPanel for PAP2 users to send a signal to them right in the headers.

quattrohead
03-05-2009, 12:04 PM
It sounds like you gave all the under dogs (5822, 287, 502) a fighting chance but they all bit you in the a$$
Old reliable wins again !!!!

ralfaro
03-05-2009, 02:04 PM
Tim, if you folks switch over totally to the PAP2, won't that allow you to then use more standard star commands? As I recall, you were forced to use non-standard commands because of the GrandStream.

RA

gbh2o
03-05-2009, 02:25 PM
The PAP2s give us more options as well. For example, we can send a reboot request or cause provisioning to resync without a reboot right in the SIP headers so it doesn't matter if it's behind the router or not.

So as an example, we can add a "reboot" option in vPanel for PAP2 users to send a signal to them right in the headers.
The remote reboot sounds like a real winner to me!

kevm
03-05-2009, 02:42 PM
How does the voice quality compare? The Grandstream does very well in that area. If it is comperable, put me on the list for the pap2

burris
03-05-2009, 02:48 PM
How does the voice quality compare? The Grandstream does very well in that area. If it is comperable, put me on the list for the pap2

Depends on whom you ask..

I had AC-211-Innomedia(yuch)-502-286-SPA-and now PAP2T

I am using 2 PAP2Ts for both of my accounts and I can say without question, that my service rivals POTS in terms of quality.
My SPA2102 was not too shabby, but I believe the PAP2 is even better..and the word reboot is not even in its vocabulary.

sr98user
03-05-2009, 03:30 PM
For me, the GS 502 voice quality is better than PAP2T that I had with my previous service provider. But I am not sure if the quality difference was due to the adapter or the provider.

KenH
03-05-2009, 03:46 PM
I have used them both. In my opinion, there is not enough difference that would cause me to choose the less stable device.

At this point, I think it's a 'no-brainer'.

Vumes
03-05-2009, 03:52 PM
Tim,

Once again, I want to thank you very much for stepping forward and bringing this to light. This is why a lot of us are here. Problems will arise, but you and your team at Voipo are always honest, and forthcoming about the challenges that are faced. This is was separates Voipo from your competition, and I have no doubt, that one day Voipo will surpass and lead the way.

I can' thank you enough, and await whatever decision you feel is necessary.

stason99
03-05-2009, 06:51 PM
Linksys SPA2102 has a built in router. If VOIPo would start replacing 502s with SPA2102 instead of PAP2Tm that would resolve the problem with routers.

burris
03-05-2009, 06:54 PM
Linksys SPA2102 has a built in router. If VOIPo would start replacing 502s with SPA2102 instead of PAP2Tm that would resolve the problem with routers.

I'm not sure the SPA2102 is in production any longer..

bretski
03-05-2009, 07:17 PM
How does the voice quality compare? The Grandstream does very well in that area. If it is comperable, put me on the list for the pap2

Having used both, my experience is that they are very comparable in terms of voice quality. Subjectively, I am partial to the PAP2T, but that could be because it stays registered. :D

...and count me among the folks that also prefers it because of the lack of routing. I wasn't pleased with the HT502's routing performance.

burris
03-05-2009, 07:46 PM
Having used both, my experience is that they are very comparable in terms of voice quality. Subjectively, I am partial to the PAP2T, but that could be because it stays registered. :D

...and count me among the folks that also prefers it because of the lack of routing. I wasn't pleased with the HT502's routing performance.

I personally haven't found the combination boxes to work well for me.

My DSL modem is in bridged mode as was my 502 and SPA2102. Personal preference, I guess. I like my wireless router to be my router.

bretski
03-05-2009, 08:24 PM
Personal preference, I guess. I like my wireless router to be my router.

Amen, brother burris!

VOIPoTim
03-07-2009, 01:40 PM
Just as a heads up, we are moving forward with the recall. This will not impact the majority of HT502s we have in use and is meant for the defective ones having the loss of registration issue only.

We are almost ready to announce how the recall is going to work and just need to finalize the logistics.

If you have a history of registration loss happening for you with the HT502, you can go ahead and open a replacement ticket for a quick review rather than waiting for the full process of identifying the users with the defective ATAs to get your situation taken care of sooner.

Replacements have already gone out or are they way out for everyone with an open ticket about the registration issue or a replacement request in cases where we could find past reports of the issue.

We also had been compiling a list of users that reported it often and they were included in that first round.

We've secured a lot of additional Linksys PAP2 inventory and it'll be arriving throughout the week with the largest shipment on Monday.

So again, for those affected by this issue, please contact support if it's still occurring so we can expedite your request outside of the replacement phases.

Xponder1
03-07-2009, 02:44 PM
Just as a heads up, we are moving forward with the recall. This will not impact the majority of HT502s we have in use and is meant for the defective ones having the loss of registration issue only.

We are almost ready to announce how the recall is going to work and just need to finalize the logistics.

If you have a history of registration loss happening for you with the HT502, you can go ahead and open a replacement ticket for a quick review rather than waiting for the full process of identifying the users with the defective ATAs to get your situation taken care of sooner.

Replacements have already gone out or are they way out for everyone with an open ticket about the registration issue or a replacement request in cases where we could find past reports of the issue.

We also had been compiling a list of users that reported it often and they were included in that first round.

We've secured a lot of additional Linksys PAP2 inventory and it'll be arriving throughout the week with the largest shipment on Monday.

So again, for those affected by this issue, please contact support if it's still occurring so we can expedite your request outside of the replacement phases.

Got my replacement today 3-7-09. Thanks!

Vumes
03-07-2009, 02:50 PM
Yes, I got mine too, but am having a hard time getting past the username/password. I don't know what they are... I searched on here, but have yet to find it. I also looked through the knowledge base and nothing. I tried the default 502 username and password combo but it didn't work.

VOIPoTim
03-07-2009, 02:54 PM
Yes, I got mine too, but am having a hard time getting past the username/password. I don't know what they are... I searched on here, but have yet to find it. I also looked through the knowledge base and nothing. I tried the default 502 username and password combo but it didn't work.

It should provision automatically. If it didn't, just contact support and they can get you situated.

Vumes
03-07-2009, 02:56 PM
It should provision automatically. If it didn't, just contact support and they can get you situated.

It did, and the voice sound wonderful.... The reason I want to be able to get in, is... IF I have to reboot the unit, I am usually at work, and I log into my home network from their and reboot the unit. I have no other way of doing this until I get home and pulling the power on it. This worked very well with the 502, being able to log in, and just hitting the reboot option.

Xponder1
03-07-2009, 03:05 PM
Yes, I got mine too, but am having a hard time getting past the username/password. I don't know what they are... I searched on here, but have yet to find it. I also looked through the knowledge base and nothing. I tried the default 502 username and password combo but it didn't work.

LOL funny when I read this I was looking for the login info myself. I know its provisioned automatically I just wanted to see what user settings there are. It would appear there are none. Sounds good to me. It is working fine.

fisamo
03-07-2009, 07:25 PM
There is no way to log in to the PAP2 and reboot it, unless you have the administration password, which you should not have for a provisioned device. If you're at home and want to reboot the device (without pulling the power cord), you can pick up your voipo phone and dial **** (you will hear "configuration menu") and enter the command 732668# (that spells REBOOT, if you look at your phone keys). I expect that you will not need to reboot this device as often as you had to do with the HT502.

Vumes
03-07-2009, 07:29 PM
Thanks Fisamo, I do understand that completely, and do understand I can pick up my phone and reboot it. But for me, that defeats the purpose. I can walk over, unplug it and plug it back in faster than I can dial. This doesn't help me when I'm not at home. I was just under the impression that it was somewhat similar to the 502 in regards to rebooting.

Xponder1
03-07-2009, 08:02 PM
Stupid question. Supplementary Service Settings Message waiting. Both user 1 and 2 are set to no. What does changing this setting do.

digger16309
03-07-2009, 09:24 PM
I was one of the 10% with registration problems. I actually asked for a PAP2 a few weeks ago just to put this to bed quickly.

Everything has worked great (PAP2 behind my router) since then.

I never liked the combo router part of the GS502 anyway and the PAP2 plays nicely with my Linksys modem and router.

bdyelton
03-09-2009, 01:26 AM
pap2t: user // 123

scott2020
03-09-2009, 08:34 AM
The PAP2 user/123 combo gives some good information, but unfortunately doesn't allow someone to remotely reboot it.

A long time ago I used to use a power strip that had a web browser built into it, and you could control the power outlets via web. I used to cycle power on modems at a remote location this way. It is kind of an expensive proposition but might be a solution.

abward
03-09-2009, 08:40 AM
I have not tried this, but maybe it would be possible to use Remote Desktop Connection (or VNC) to remotely contact a PC on your LAN, then use a dial string in the modem of that PC to send the ****732668# to restart the PAP2T?

stason99
03-09-2009, 08:52 AM
Just wondering... if you guys are preparing to keep rebooting PAP2T, what was the point of switching from 502 to PAP2T? Is PAP2T a solution or a "probable solution" ?

abward
03-09-2009, 09:00 AM
Well, yeah. I have not had to reboot mine because of an error condition, yet. I have rebooted it probably a dozen times because of changes made by support to my PAP2T, and I had to reboot after each change attempt. But, I did that via the pull the plug method each time, since I work from home.

The PAP2T really has been quite stable for me so far.

scott2020
03-09-2009, 09:44 AM
I haven't had to reboot mine since I have had it, so I don't expect it will need to be rebooted at all. At least I hope so! It is a 'just in case' thing I guess. It was nice to be able to reboot the GS remotely.

I suppose VOIPo can reboot it remotely, should that ever be necessary. I understand Tim said many things can be sent in the SIP messages to the PAP2, so maybe a reboot is one of them? Maybe something like that could be added to VPanel?

Scott

fisamo
03-09-2009, 10:30 AM
I haven't had to reboot mine since I have had it, so I don't expect it will need to be rebooted at all. At least I hope so! It is a 'just in case' thing I guess. It was nice to be able to reboot the GS remotely.

I suppose VOIPo can reboot it remotely, should that ever be necessary. I understand Tim said many things can be sent in the SIP messages to the PAP2, so maybe a reboot is one of them? Maybe something like that could be added to VPanel?

Scott

I recall Tim indicating that they could reboot the PAP2 remotely, where that's not possible with the HT502 for some reason. If that's the case, a 'reboot' button somewhere in vPanel might not be a bad idea. IIRC, if the PAP receives a reboot command while it's in use, it will hold off on the reboot until the line is idle. (I hope voipo confirms this before making a reboot button available on the vPanel! :) )

chpalmer
03-09-2009, 10:36 AM
(I hope voipo confirms this before making a reboot button available on the vPanel! :) )

But you know how much fun Id have with my wife and kids while I was at work... :D

burris
03-09-2009, 10:40 AM
I recall Tim indicating that they could reboot the PAP2 remotely, where that's not possible with the HT502 for some reason. If that's the case, a 'reboot' button somewhere in vPanel might not be a bad idea. IIRC, if the PAP receives a reboot command while it's in use, it will hold off on the reboot until the line is idle. (I hope voipo confirms this before making a reboot button available on the vPanel! :) )

If my experience thus far with the SPA2102 and now the PAP2T is meaningful, I have yet to reboot to maintain phone service. Only if it's something I am doing on my network that requires a reboot, do I do so.

fisamo
03-09-2009, 03:50 PM
I'm mainly thinking of the situation where support changes a provisioning file. (And the 'comfort factor' as it's been oft requested in the wake of the HT502 issues...) :)

Xponder1
03-09-2009, 04:35 PM
I am happy to say my ATA is still going strong. I love this Linksys!

kevm
03-10-2009, 01:46 PM
just hooked up my pap2t and disconnected grandstream. Granstream was in front, but by design pap2t is in back. Can someone tell me the login and address for the pap2t?

Thanks

kevm
03-10-2009, 01:48 PM
it looks like it picked up a dhcp address .197 from my d link router. What are the login credentials?

Thanks

VOIPoTim
03-10-2009, 02:20 PM
it looks like it picked up a dhcp address .197 from my d link router. What are the login credentials?

Thanks

User: user
Pass: 123