Issues with available numbers and rate centers

Based on previous posts, I was under the impression that the pool of cities and numbers had increased recently.

When creating a new account tonight, I have found that some of the cities I'm used to seeing are no longer available (before, even if they didn't have numbers available, at least the city was available for a search), and others aren't displaying numbers, but continuously display "loading" instead...

Examples:
State: TX City: Austin - Not available in listing
State: TX City: San Marcos - Not available in listing
State: MD City: Columbia (Surrounding Areas) Select a Number: shows "Loading"

Are the enhancements still being loaded, or am I seeing some anomalies that should be addressed?

I agree.

I've put in a ticket to inform the complete loss of Canadian Virtual numbers, the loss of Wildwood FL, and the Canadian numbers in the Full account creation has again shrunk to it former short list from a robust list.

NPX-553284

All three instances still hold true.

When we restructured the inventory recently, there were a few changes:

1) Areas which we have no inventory in and our carriers with APIs have no inventory in are removed and re-added nightly when new inventory is available. Previously we had a lot of areas where we did a "To Be Assigned" and would order from alternate carriers. Since all but one of our carriers is integrated into the form now, it's rare that TBA would result in anything now if it's not listed already.

2) In terms of Canada, we're still reviewing the situation. In the past we've had coverage in a handful of Canadian cities via one of our US carriers. We had constant complaints about not being able to port into Canada easily and the limited coverage. People would get very upset because we'd have coverage in a Canadian city smaller than a metro Canadian city, etc.

Our feeling is that if we're going to offer Canadian DIDs, we need to just work with a Canadian carrier for those rather that using the limited coverage offered by a US carrier partner. We're still reviewing it to determine what we're doing with Canada and how deep we want to get into it (if we do much, we'd need to start complying with all Canadian taxation/regulation too).

3) The last thing we did was remove some high-cost areas from the list. This should not be many, but there are some areas where it's just not cost effective to offer service in due to the wholesale CLEC costs being 5x as much as metro areas.

For Rate Centers you definitely support, I am hoping there is at least a CSV file made available to Resellers. If we are to provide the whole sign-up process on our own website, we will need to have a way to reliably convey what they can order. That does not mean actual inventory, just STATE, CITY, COUNTRY, NPA, NXX, RATE-CENTER.

Also another field that indicates FULL-VIRTUAL-BOTH if there would be exceptions for such availability.

Also another field that informs us of current quantities.

STATE, CITY, COUNTRY, NPA, NXX, RATE-CENTER, FULL-VIRTUAL-BOTH, QTY

And a separate CSV for Forwarded numbers if they will be different.

The inventory for all the types will be consistently.

I don't think we'd be able to predict quantity or inventory levels. Basically 90% of the areas are pulled from upstream carriers directly via API. I know with one particular carrier all major VoIP providers are pretty much using the API (they claim over 200 using it) so the inventory changes constantly since all are accessing the same pool of numbers. Some areas we carry the inventory in...but not many.

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Originally Posted by VOIPoTim

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1) Areas which we have no inventory in and our carriers with APIs have no inventory in are removed and re-added nightly when new inventory is available. Previously we had a lot of areas where we did a "To Be Assigned" and would order from alternate carriers. Since all but one of our carriers is integrated into the form now, it's rare that TBA would result in anything now if it's not listed already.
...

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Tim, I would consider Austin a Major Metropolitan Area... how is it that no numbers are available for assignment in a big city such as this. And, when this happens, what should we tell customers (i.e. what are you telling yours)/what should we do next...

1. "Sorry, we don't currently have numbers available in your area" (send 'em somewhere else)?
2. "Let me work on getting you a good number in your area" (reseller calls VOIPo support and asks for additional research to get a number)?

I can certainly understand when numbers aren't available in "po-dunk" wherever (no offense to anyone living or having lived in "po-dunk"), but a MMA? That seems strange.

Just evaluating a strategy... the majority of my business in in Austin and surrounding. If I'm going to run into instances of "sorry, don't have any numbers", that could be a challenge.

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Originally Posted by MacGyverLabs

Tim, I would consider Austin a Major Metropolitan Area... how is it that no numbers are available for assignment in a big city such as this. And, when this happens, what should we tell customers (i.e. what are you telling yours)/what should we do next...

1. "Sorry, we don't currently have numbers available in your area" (send 'em somewhere else)?
2. "Let me work on getting you a good number in your area" (reseller calls VOIPo support and asks for additional research to get a number)?

I can certainly understand when numbers aren't available in "po-dunk" wherever (no offense to anyone living or having lived in "po-dunk"), but a MMA? That seems strange.

Just evaluating a strategy... the majority of my business in in Austin and surrounding. If I'm going to run into instances of "sorry, don't have any numbers", that could be a challenge.

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I understand where you're coming from. Austin is definitely a decent size city. HostGator just purchased a new office building in Austin to open another office which will become their headquarter...so I'm familiar with it.

The 2 major carriers we use have no Austin numbers in their API though at this time which is why they're not showing up. Since it's a metro area, I'm assuming inventory should be replenished pretty quickly.

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Originally Posted by VOIPoTim

The 2 major carriers we use have no Austin numbers in their API though at this time which is why they're not showing up.

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That supports the need for a CSV file with this minimal criteria:

STATE, CITY, COUNTRY, NPA, NXX, RATE-CENTER

That way it is assured that the numbers can at least be ordered.

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Originally Posted by usa2k

That supports the need for a CSV file with this minimal criteria:

STATE, CITY, COUNTRY, NPA, NXX, RATE-CENTER

That way it is assured that the numbers can at least be ordered.

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My concern though is that if the carriers don't have any, then we wouldn't be able to manually order them either. Since there'd be no timeline I was hesitant to let people order them not knowing when the carriers may replenish them (could be a day, could be weeks).

So now the customer will go elsewhere, when possibly they could have gotten a number by becoming a customer and waiting a few days.

I'm just a retail residential customer, but based on the current list of available numbers, I would have not switched from Callcentric to Voipo. Not only is my "podunk" area not listed, but Cedar Rapids, Iowa is not listed. It's the second largest city in Iowa, while some cities of 3,000 people ARE listed. Both areas are covered by Qwest as the ILEC. I assume Paetec (not sure if you are using them, but would guess that you are) is a CLEC that is available at least in Cedar Rapids, not sure of the podunk.

I guess I'm saying that I much preferred the "to be assigned" system rather than the guess if coverage might be available tomorrow/next week system now in place.

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Originally Posted by uhf

I guess I'm saying that I much preferred the "to be assigned" system rather than the guess if coverage might be available tomorrow/next week system now in place.

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I understand that, but in some cases it was a month before carriers had inventory in and we have very hostile people getting impatient waiting for their number. This increases support costs a lot since customers have to contact support and it's not automated.

Pros and cons to all ways and we're open to finding a better way, but if we can't give a definitive timeline for the "unavailable" areas to have new numbers issued, customers get very hostile very quickly.

We've found that most customers see a location isn't available and will order a closeby area rather than waiting.

Corrected, and a big list
http://www.telcodata.us/telcodata/ratecenter?ratecenter=CEDAR%20RPDS&state=IA

Austin TX is huge
http://www.telcodata.us/telcodata/ra...USTIN&state=TX

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Originally Posted by usa2k

Looks like Quest has a lock on Cedar rapids
http://www.telcodata.us/telcodata/cl...de=CDRRIADTDS0

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There's definitely others. 360 Networks is one. Looks like that is probably the carrier in question in this case. I have one of their DIDs now in Independence, Iowa (from Voipo). MegaPop/StarNet is another possibility, although I haven't found a list of exchanges they cover yet. They have dial up internet numbers there.

Makes me think I better hold onto that virtual number I have instead of having it canceled when my Qwest number ports, which should be Monday. I may not be able to get one again if I want one, and it's a xx00 number, which is always nice.

edit to add: 360 shows current availability in Cedar Rapids. Wonder why it's not available through Voipo, or maybe it won't show up until tomorrow?

I had clicked on the wrong link - it is corrected in my post.
Sorry for miss-information!

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Originally Posted by VOIPoTim

I understand that, but in some cases it was a month before carriers had inventory in and we have very hostile people getting impatient waiting for their number. This increases support costs a lot since customers have to contact support and it's not automated.

Pros and cons to all ways and we're open to finding a better way, but if we can't give a definitive timeline for the "unavailable" areas to have new numbers issued, customers get very hostile very quickly.

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Alright, Tim's comments and USA2K's list for Austin gave me an idea...
I noticed that MagicJack has 26,000 Austin numbers reserved - presumably significant 'internal' inventory they've decided to reserve.

I, like some others have mentioned, are primarily interested in serving a specific geographic area (in my case, Austin - a large MSA). However, numbers continue to be scarce (or nonexistent - depending upon the moment you check via the API). So, what if resellers could keep their own inventory for areas of specific interest to them...

That said, here's the proposed 'better way'...
Presumably, VOIPo pays significantly less than $1/month to 'rent' a DID (I know - price likely varies by rate center). In addition to the $1/month VOIPo would charge resellers for an 'active' number, would it be possible/feasible for you guys to offer an additional feature to resellers... inventory capture?

For example... In addition to the 'create account' function, I could have a 'buy inventory' function with the same drop down boxes that would allow me to 'buy' a number and place it on my reseller account, with these considerations...

• These numbers would be reserved for my reseller account, but would remain 'unassigned' to any reseller customer account and thus would not have any activity - yet be available exclusively to that reseller account.
• VOIPo would pass on the expense of renting the number (maybe at cost or just slightly over) - presumably something around $0.25/month/number, if my wholesale DID research is accurate - and some areas go for around $.15/number/month (an example/suggestion - not trying to set policy, Tim!).
• When creating a new account in the reseller CP, a new option would appear in the "state" drop-down called "Inventory", which would then pop a dropdown of all available inventory numbers in numerical order. (Or, better yet, inventory numbers would appear mingled in with their appropriate state/city service area selection, possibly designated with an asterisk or something to indicate it is an inventory item... that way I can decide to pick a 'new' number, or select an existing inventory item)
• Once placed in service on a customer account, the number then begins billing as an 'active' number at $1/month.
• Ideally, when an account is 'canceled', resellers would have the option of fully canceling the number as we do today, or canceling the customer account and returning the number to reseller inventory.

This would allow those resellers experiencing number acquisition challenges to carry their own inventory (at a reasonable cost) for areas they are especially interested in serving, rather than risk having to turn customers away. With this design, each individual reseller would also be able to determine their own cost/benefit/risk threshold for inventory.

So, what'dya think?

+1 for that thought!

I suspect ordering numbers may also involve a minimum quantity, so if that is the case, it could be part of the criteria. I do not know if they all have to be from 1 area either?

Not to make this overly complex ... There may also be the option of choosing the reserved inventory that allows outbound CNAM, Phone Book Listing, and other things that the Reseller could charge more for if targeting Business Clients.

Within the next few weeks, we're adding our primary CLEC to the inventory via API. They have [pretty substantial coverage (top 2600 ratecenters) with at least a few hundred numbers in each ratecenter.

Here is an example of just Texas ratecenters offered: http://www.telcodata.us/telcodata/co...H.COM&state=TX

Once we integrate their API, the inventory will go up a lot.

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Originally Posted by VOIPoTim

Once we integrate their API, the inventory will go up a lot.

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This might be good for me... Before BW.com inventory was sparse.

Tim, by adding BW.com does that mean I might move up a tier? Right now I am in tier 3 per your excel spreadsheet.

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Originally Posted by zevin

This might be good for me... Before BW.com inventory was sparse.

Tim, by adding BW.com does that mean I might move up a tier? Right now I am in tier 3 per your excel spreadsheet.

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That's with BW factored in. Tier 0 is BW. Tiers 1-3 are others (Level3, Paetec, Broadvox, etc)

oh, my party just got shut down.... :(

Tim, has there been any thought on Resellers reserving blocks of numbers?

• Say 20 numbers from one Rate Center for $2.00/month.
  
  • Some reasonable quantity and price.
  
  
  
  • Maybe a reserve setup fee.
    
    • So our target markets have inventory
    • Inventory could recharge at a trigger point.
    
    
  
  

They would switch to $1 or $5 monthly when in use like regular inventory.

They are talking on the forums too.
http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r238...ection-of-DIDs

EDIT: Perhaps the new CLEC will make such need for inventory moot.

Here is my reply from there:


We've optimized our DID ordering process recently.

We did remove some rural areas in which we've determined it's just not cost effective to do business in.

Your issue is more around the optimization though...

We work with many CLECs and carrier partners and often each ratecenter is priced differently with each of them. We get most DIDs via APIs.

In the past, our order forms just showed ALL DIDs from multiple carrier partners and mixed them together. In some cases, people would end up with DIDs from carrier partners that cost 5x more than others in their area. All carrier partners that we work with have great quality so that's not an issue. There's no functional difference besides price.

Now the order form looks at every ratecenter to determine the most cost effective carrier for that ratecenter. It shows the inventory from the most cost effective carrier choice first and will only advance to the next carrier if first first choice is sold out.

This may sound like it doesn't make a big difference, but just by going through and "optimizing" our existing DIDs recently by doing internal ports to move them to the most cost effective carrier, we're now saving around $14,000 per month. It's little details like this that determine profitability or failure in this industry and why so many people fail.

For those of you looking for wider selection though, there is some good news. We will soon to integrating another CLEC into the ordering process via API. This is a CLEC that we've worked with for years, but have recently signed a huge deal for origination with. Once integrated in the API, this CLEC will be our primary for number ordering in the 2600 top ratecenters in the country. They have over 1000 sequential numbers in most ratecenters and only a handful of companies using their API (I believe 4), so there are some pretty good numbers to choose from.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by VOIPoTim

Within the next few weeks, we're adding our primary CLEC to the inventory via API. They have [pretty substantial coverage (top 2600 ratecenters) with at least a few hundred numbers in each ratecenter.

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Tim,
Any update on integration of the BW CLEC? Inventory is running kind of thin in my rate center, so I was curious if I might see an increase any time soon?

Thanks!

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Originally Posted by MacGyverLabs

Tim,
Any update on integration of the BW CLEC? Inventory is running kind of thin in my rate center, so I was curious if I might see an increase any time soon?

Thanks!

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Bandwidth CLEC is now added into all the main areas of the site. We're adding to reseller number ordering today. They only return 100 numbers at a time but have a lot more than that in most RCs so if you only see 100, don't worry.

I spy another field at the end of the list of states.

• Purchased Inventory
  
  • Is it to reclaim canceled numbers?
  
  

• Ported Numbers
  
  • Is it to reclaim temporary numbers after LNP replaced them?
  
  

In any case, it will be great to learn about them :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by usa2k

I spy another field at the end of the list of states.

• Purchased Inventory
  
  • Is it to reclaim canceled numbers?
  
  

• Ported Numbers
  
  • Is it to reclaim temporary numbers after LNP replaced them?
  
  

In any case, it will be great to learn about them :)

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These are still being wrapped up, but basically here's how it works.

You can now purchase numbers on the phone numbers page for your own private inventory at half price. You're billed $0.50 per month for them. They will be available to order/use for accounts in your "Inventory" state/city. When you assign it to an account, the next renewal on it adjusts to the normal $1. This will allow you to buy a block of numbers that only you can use even if you don't have access to immediately assign them to.

When you submit a port, it will go into your "Ported Number" state/city to assign to an account/use.

FYI Bandwidth CLEC is not fully integrated in reseller number ordering too.

And many questions arise from that info.
No immediate answer needed, just brainstorming a bit.

I expect the numbers will be available to assign as Full or Forwarded accounts?

Will canceled numbers go there too? Add a canceled list?

Can certain numbers get dropped from the list at our discretion too?

The confusing part is that all the numbers could have endless renewal dates while on hold. Unless they all get synced to one date.

I expect a newly reassigned number would get billed again right away
since that would then match the customer billing date.

Canceled numbers are canceled and removed from the system.

When you have a number in your private inventory @ $0.50, it retains its origination renewal date. So when you assign it to an account, it doesn't immediately get billed $1, just the next time it would normally renew @ $0.50, it'll renew at $1.

Basically all numbers maintain their origination renewal date no matter how assign. The only thing that changes is the $ amount.

And the $5 Unlimited Inbound: Any new thoughts?

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Originally Posted by usa2k

And the $5 Unlimited Inbound: Any new thoughts?

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It's something we will likely do eventually but I don't expect it in this first launch. A lot of billing changes need to be made to allow that and we're planning on soft launch this month, so we're pretty much done adding new features at least for first version. Once it's launched, we'll continuing adding and will be doing releases likely each month or so.

Has the BW API integration been temporarily suspended?

There were at least 60-80 numbers available in my rate center after integration earlier this week, but as of yesterday (or maybe Thursday), the BW NPA-NXX's are gone, and I'm back to having less than 10 numbers to choose from.

Any indication as to when the BW numbers will be available again?

Bandwidth is still fully integrated. I just checked in their portal and they have no Austin numbers in stock now so our form failed over to a secondary provider.

Number inventory changes like that a lot with wholesale carriers since a wholesale customer can come in and reserve a large block for their internal inventory. That's likely what happened with Bandwidth.