Outage - 1AM Central

[Xponder1]

Do you work for VOIPo? Just curious

Nope. I have only had VOIPo since December. I found out about VOIPo from the Hostgator forums in a thread Tim posted about the service. However, from my experiences with Tim and the others at VOIPo I have found them to be very upfront and honest. Tim personally has replied to my tickets in the middle of the night on a weekend. The man is dedicated! I know they have spent a lot of time trying to resolve this problem.

I have also done a lot of reading of past threads here on the forums to get myself caught up on their history. The current offer is a really
good deal and I am so confident they will fix the problem one way or another that I was comfortable with paying for another year. This offer is too good to pass up.

Well, not all of these problems are related to Grandstream. The last two outages were caused by their hardware malfunction and a “major breakdown in communication”.
So I wish I could point fingers at Grandstream, but other VOIP providers (like PhonePower) use Grandstream with no issues. Therefore, I don’t understand why they are
planning to recall Grandstreams and replace them with Linksys’. It won’t fix hardware failures on their servers and miscommunication. I’m not trying to be rude or anything
and I hope the Moderator won’t delete this.

Your half correct. You see while the original cause of the problem was a hardware malfunction or a major breakdown in communication 90% of the devices reconnected by themselves. They are set to reconnect every minute right now so they should be hammering away trying to reconnect. From my understanding the Linksys devices all reconnected with no issue.

For some reason it seems they really do not like being behind a router. That is not a VOIPo issue. The Linksys products have no problem being located behind a router. The 502 just gives up for some reason. That sounds like a firmware issue.

As for other providers using Grandstream from reading past posts VOIPo used another Grandsteam device and it worked fine. Just because other providers use Grandstream devices does not mean they use a 502. It also does not mean they are configured the same by Grandstream. My understanding from Tim's replies is that the 502 was selected for 2 main reasons. First it has a built in router (which I have tested and must say I do not recommend anyone use it as a router). Second it makes more business since because Grandstream configures all the ATA's for them. You just hook it up and it connects to Grandstream and updates to the settings for VOIPo. Tim has acknowledged the Linksys devices are overall reliable but Linksys does not want to work with them the way Grandstream offered to. So they have to configure them all themselves.

As for the mod's they are not going to delete your post LOL.

Yes, I am giving them a chance to fix all that, and I’m trying to be patient. But unfortunately I can see that there are many causes of unstable service, not just one. And every time something new comes up….

Actually, the problems really started very recently. There have been many "symptoms" of the problem and they have been trying to address the symptoms as the have been reported which actually resulted in more problems. Addressing the symptoms is not fixing the
underlaying cause of the problem. While its frustrating to have a problem a couple times a week that causes you to have to reboot the ATA 90% of the customers are not having a problem. Overall the service is up 98% of the time even if your one of the minority like you and me with the issues.

Continue being patient and I am positive your patience will pay off.

Yes, I can see that they work really hard to fix all that, and I appreciate that. However, I would praise someone for great results but not for great attempts.

I agree with you. However as I have already pointed out the problem is a Grandstream firmware or hardware issue. If it were a VOIPo issue all of the BYOD folks and the others who have the Linksys would have a issue. I have another 502 that was sent to me and that thing was dead out of the box.

After it warms up if you make a call the moment it connects it sounds like the audio jumps 2000% and its so loud the speaker on the phones can not handle it. Personally I am convinced the 502 is just a faulty product (others opinions may vary).

I like that Tim is always there upfront and telling us what happened and to best of his knowledge why and what they are doing to get it resolved.

>>>>> and they have adjusted accounts on their own for time without service (most companies would wait for the customer to ask credit).
Not true. I am asking for that refund and so far they denied it.
You can try to ask for it and see what happens. This is a reason of my frustration here. Service down for a day – no compensation...

I did not say they gave a cash credit. What they did do and Tim can confirm this for you is extend your paid period for the time without service.
I will not be surprised if they do again either. You can search threw the forums here and find Tim's replies on the issue that very clearly
state what is being done for customers. After all this I am too lazy to search for his exact quote. LOL

Oh, and never has the service ever been down for more than a few hours. How long it takes to resolve it usually depends on how long it takes you to check your email and unplug the ATA.

What I really agree with you is that VOIPo has done a great job of communicating the issues to the customers. Customer service is responsive; in general their communication is great.
But like I said, this is just talks so far. I really hope to see real results. And I hope you share this with me.

I don’t think this has anything to do with overheating of HT502s. After service goes down VOIPo announces the reason why this happened. If it would be overheating then it would be
random and not for everyone at the same time.
Xponder1, thanks for response. I hope VOIPo won’t cut this post.

I would like to see results too. Tim's email this morning and most recent post on the forums lay out a timeline and explain pretty clearly what to expect.
As for the overheating issue well that is something I just brought up today. I thought of it because of the issue with the DSL modem I had. Model's with a
certain serial number (which is hundreds of thousands of them) have a chipset that causes them to get so hot they either die, malfunction, or in some cases
flat out melt. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r217...-modem-is-junk

I only brought it up because it seems everything else has been looked in to but never has the temp of the device been mentioned. I layed mine down on the
desk and the outside bottom of the unit got up to 140 degrees in a 73 degree room. That is a lot of heat! I have one of those nifty infrared things
for checking the temp and in comparison my new Two Wire DSL modem/wireless router is max 95 degrees. The old modem was really hot and about the exact same size as the 502. It may have nothing to do with heat. Maybe some issues like this other 502 I have here are heat related. As far as the heat goes I am simply pointing out a observation. Electronics hate heat!

[burris]

I would like to see results too. Tim's email this morning and most recent post on the forums lay out a timeline and explain pretty clearly what to expect.
As for the overheating issue well that is something I just brought up today. I thought of it because of the issue with the DSL modem I had. Model's with a
certain serial number (which is hundreds of thousands of them) have a chipset that causes them to get so hot they either die, malfunction, or in some cases
flat out melt. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r217...-modem-is-junk

I only brought it up because it seems everything else has been looked in to but never has the temp of the device been mentioned. I layed mine down on the
desk and the outside bottom of the unit got up to 140 degrees in a 73 degree room. That is a lot of heat! I have one of those nifty infrared things
for checking the temp and in comparison my new Two Wire DSL modem/wireless router is max 95 degrees. The old modem was really hot and about the exact same size as the 502. It may have nothing to do with heat. Maybe some issues like this other 502 I have here are heat related. As far as the heat goes I am simply pointing out a observation. Electronics hate heat!

I think heat may be one of the factors.
You mention the Netopia/Motorola DSL modem. The first 2 I had got so hot you could fry an egg on it.
We then found out that the ones with S.N. 47xxxxxxx and below were the culprits and were being recalled when a complaint was issued.

My latest one begins with S.N. 48xxxxxx and it is many times cooler than the older runs.

And throughout all this, there are probably millions of 2210s out there that continue to work.

[Xponder1]

I think heat may be one of the factors.
You mention the Netopia/Motorola DSL modem. The first 2 I had got so hot you could fry an egg on it.
We then found out that the ones with S.N. 47xxxxxxx and below were the culprits and were being recalled when a complaint was issued.

My latest one begins with S.N. 48xxxxxx and it is many times cooler than the older runs.

And throughout all this, there are probably millions of 2210s out there that continue to work.

Ya mine was replaced at least 4 times. My last one was a year old. My mother who has only had hers three months had one of the recall sn's. They sent me another but then when I did some research and found out what was wrong I just wanted it replaced. They have newer ones (but that dsl modem is not being made anymore) that have a different chip and they do not get hot. Either way I did not want to deal with it anymore. Spoke to retention and they sent me a 2-wire free. They did the same for my mother.

They are just trying to get rid of the stock. You could get a newer one or a older one. Some even get a used one *sigh*

[stason99]

As for other providers using Grandstream from reading past posts VOIPo used another Grandsteam device and it worked fine. Just because other providers use Grandstream devices does not mean they use a 502. It also does not mean they are configured the same by Grandstream.

PhonePower currently ships Grandstream HT502. http://support.phonepower.com/Home/t...e/Default.aspx . I’m not advertising or anything. Just for information purpose. They are shipping it for quite long time as I read on forums. And they don’t have frequent disconnection issues. Too much depends on how the whole structure of a VOIP company is organized, and not just a user’s hardware. The fact that another company is using HT502s with no problems is a very important argument here.

My understanding from Tim's replies is that the 502 was selected for 2 main reasons. First it has a built in router (which I have tested and must say I do not recommend anyone use it as a router). Second it makes more business since because Grandstream configures all the ATA's for them.

There was a post somewhere on http://www.dslreports.com/forum/voip which says that VOIPo chose HT502 because they got many on them (thousands) left from another company that Timothy was running, and it was a good deal since they got them either for free or very cheap. As I recall, that post was made by Timothy. Sorry for not providing a link. I know it sounds like if I was spreading rumors or something… If anyone had encountered that post, please, give us a link.

I agree with you. However as I have already pointed out the problem is a Grandstream firmware or hardware issue. If it were a VOIPo issue all of the BYOD folks and the others who have the Linksys would have a issue. I have another 502 that was sent to me and that thing was dead out of the box.

Some PAP2T users lost registration anyway. http://forums.voipo.com/showthread.php?t=1226&page=2 (post from wagnerb ).

VOIPo offered me to switch to PAP2T but I refused because in this case I would need to spend extra $40 for a router, which I normally don’t need. And I would spend some time to configure all that. They refused to pay for a router that I would buy. You just sign up knowing that you will get a free adapter, but soon realize that you must spend extra money for a router if you want to make your phone line finally work. This is somewhat ridiculous. All I’m saying is that this is not the way business should run. I’m still giving then a chance to fix the problem with 502s.

I did not say they gave a cash credit. What they did do and Tim can confirm this for you is extend your paid period for the time without service.

It took me 2 days of communication and 8 ticket replies total to get the 14 days credit. I was repeatedly told that this is against company’s policy. Even after rebate was issued, Tim wrote:
“We do not provide any SLA or uptime guarantee for residential service and the service is provided on an as-is basis. Please refer to the TOS if you have additional questions about this policy.”

I’m saying that some promises on forum is one thing but real life examples is different.

Oh, and never has the service ever been down for more than a few hours. How long it takes to resolve it usually depends on how long it takes you to check your email and unplug the ATA.

Yes. But if registration is lost when my wife is home and I’m at work, I simply can’t call through. She doesn’t have a cell (she doesn’t really need one). She doesn’t go online too often, and there’s no way for me to reset that damn adapter or call her any other way. When she doesn’t receive calls because she thinks no one calls, that’s all. So, in my case the outage is for a whole day! Now, I guess, she has to sit next to the adapter and reset it every 5 minutes.

Because I predict another outage within next 1-2 weeks. We’ll see.

While there’s some criticism in my post here, I still hope VOIPo will not delete it. After all, I wish them do best and I’m still the customer.

[NY Tel Guy]

Yes. But if registration is lost when my wife is home and I’m at work, I simply can’t call through. She doesn’t have a cell (she doesn’t really need one). She doesn’t go online too often, and there’s no way for me to reset that damn adapter or call her any other way. When she doesn’t receive calls because she thinks no one calls, that’s all. So, in my case the outage is for a whole day! Now, I guess, she has to sit next to the adapter and reset it every 5 minutes.

I think you need to get your wife a 9.99 family share phone in case of an emergency.

[stason99]

I think you need to get your wife a 9.99 family share phone in case of an emergency.

Haven’t seen a family share phone for 9.99

[NY Tel Guy]

Haven’t seen a family share phone for 9.99

All companies offer family share / add a line for 9.99 and there are free phones that they offer (obviously you have to look at each carrier).

[fisamo]

Rather than taking the thread in a negative direction...

1. VOIPo isn't perfect, but Tim is working on it.
2. Tim did mention possibly getting a 'deal' on some HT502's from a different company that was going under and had excess inventory. However, I do not believe that was the reason for switching to the 502, it was a means of getting extra inventory at a low cost.
3. Family share plans--offered by both Verizon and AT&T--if you have a "family share plan" the primary line's cost is in line with an individual plan (maybe a variation in cost or # mins included), and add-on lines are $9.99/mo each. The included minutes are shared between both the primary and add-on lines... Obviously, this is not much of an option if the primary line is provided by an employer or if the primary line is a prepaid cell. The point here, though, is that it's probably worth getting a prepaid cell or an add-on line (if your primary line can be converted to a 'family plan') at this time.

Let's please all keep in mind that this forum is intended for community-based customer support. It's great to be enthusiastic about the product being offered here and the service that's provided. But we do have to acknowledge the bumps in the road and understand that not everyone will have the same level of service.

As for equipment, outages, fault, etc. Yes it's true the Phonepower uses the HT502. Unless a PP user or rep posts the info, you don't know what firmware version they're running, each ISP adds variables to the situation, etc. My point is that there may well be issues on voipo's end, your ISP's end, Grandstream's end, etc. At some level, you have to accept the situation for what it is and decide on the best path forward. A few suggestions were made by others in posts above--let me recap and add one or two of my own:
1. Get your wife a cell phone (prepaid, add-on to family share plan if possible, or primary line). I realize your wife doesn't need one per your post above, but it is something to consider.
2. Exchange out your HT502 for a PAP2T. Yes, if you do so you'll have to purchase a router which is, understandably, not your preferred route.
3. Consider obtaining a different ATA on your own, and configure it yourself. For example, you could get a SPA-2102 from ebay (buyer beware). Granted, if you're going to spend that money, you'd probably be better off getting a router and a PAP2T from voipo.
4. Get a bare-bones POTS line so you can call in to your wife if there is a service interruption.

I realize that all of these options require time and/or money on your part and that they wouldn't be necessary if voipo had everything working on the HT502 as it should. Here's to hoping that situation is resolved, or will be soon, or that voipo is able to send you a different router/ATA combo unit that will meet your needs. Obviously, in the event that all of the above does NOT work out, you're probably best off going with a different phone service provider at this time. Does that mean that voipo is a bad company? Of course not--it just means that they may not be the best choice for you at this time. There's certainly nothing wrong with that. Best of luck with a speedy, satisfactory resolution. If you have any other troubles that you think can be answered on the forum, please feel free to post.

[Sorry for the "mod-like" lecture--I'm not a mod and don't want to be (nor am I affiliated with VOIPo in any way other than being a customer, former Beta tester, and HG customer). I thought twice about posting it, given that I'm not a mod, but as you can see, I decided to put it out there anyway. ]

[usa2k]

R
2. Tim did mention possibly getting a 'deal' on some HT502's from a different company that was going under and had excess inventory. However, I do not believe that was the reason for switching to the 502, it was a means of getting extra inventory at a low cost.

Yes, I recall now ... Chinese New Year and inventory was going to run out over that week because demand was way high. I don't know if they sourced any GT502 in the long run, because they switched to PAPT2 to keep customers supplied.

Thanks for the memory jog!
http://forums.voipo.com/showpost.php?p=8857&postcount=1

[stason99]

As I predicted earlier, there was an outage again this morning. Was it only me, or anyone else had this?
Here’s what I wrote here on 03-06-2009:

Because I predict another outage within next 1-2 weeks. We’ll see.

PAP2T users: did you have an outage?

Rather than taking the thread in a negative direction...
1. Get your wife a cell phone (prepaid, add-on to family share plan if possible, or primary line). I realize your wife doesn't need one per your post above, but it is something to consider........
.........
.........
4. Get a bare-bones POTS line so you can call in to your wife if there is a service interruption.

I realize that all of these options require time and/or money on your part and that they wouldn't be necessary if voipo had everything working on the HT502 as it should.

I really appreciate your calm response and explanations. I agree with the most.
However, we have to keep in mind that the main purpose of switching from POTS to a VOIP is saving money (while getting even more features). I was paying $46 a month for Verizon POTS and I didn’t even have a caller ID. So, if the new VOIP service requires extra expenses as backups services etc.(a cell phone when you don’t normally need one), that brings benefits of a VOIP line to zero. If a service is so unreliable so that you have to back it up then there’s no need for such service (if it’s not finally fixed of course).